Commentary By Ron Beasley
I reported on my health care adventure last weekend here. The ambulance bill was $731 and about what I has expected. I can't say the same for the hospital bill I received today.
That's right, $4,168.15 for a 12 hour hospital stay. If I had insurance the insurance company would have paid about half of this amount and the hospital would have written the remaineder off, I am being required to subsidize the for profit insurance companies.
2 things shocked me, the ambulance bill and the $1,200 per month cost of the insurance plan you were looking at before 60. Gad you are OK. Paramedic fees where I live -Ontario - are $245 if it isn't an emergency or ordered by a doctor or $45 for all other calls. The $45 is a the co-pay fee which is waved itself under certain circumstance. I, of course, pay no general health insurance fees, its in my taxes. I do pay $30 a month for my additional health care coverage under my Public Service Health Care Plan ( my former employer the federal gov't pays another $30) - it picks up drug costs outside of hospitals, ambulance co-pays, any additional cost with a semi-private hospital room, glasses, dental surgery, physiotherapy outside a hospital, etc..
ReplyDeleteI think I've got a good deal. As a rough estimate my federal and provincial income tax bill is usually about 25% of my gross income.
See my post at On My Mind today.
ReplyDeleteKey quote, and gits of the quote,
Obama cut a deal with drug companies that in pushing health care reform he would not challenge their pricing. Obama cut a similar deal with the hospitals that he would not challenge their pricing. Obama then prates about "bending the cost curve" and "making health care affordable" by slinging mud at insurance companies.
My wife (who is a hospitalist) wonders if there was a time while you were ill (before it got serious enough for a 911 call) that you might have called your family doctor for advice if you had insurance?
ReplyDeleteCaught in time, your problem would have likely resulted in a $50 office visit and a prescription for a relatively inexpensive antibiotic. In her hospital, she frequently sees patients presenting with catastrophic conditions that should have been nipped at a safer, cheaper stage.
Jim
ReplyDeleteThis happened very fast and unfortunately on a weekend. What seemed to be a fairly common cold on Saturday afternoon, something you wouldn't go to the Doctor for, morphed into a medical emergency at 1:00 AM Sunday morning.
Ouch. No surprise there, though. I slipped on a Pergo floor last year and landed on my head, which scrambled my brain long enough for the son to feel he needed to call an ambulance and the fee was about the same. Luckily, COBRA paid part of it.
ReplyDeletegeoff, I'm on COBRA at the moment to the tune of almost $700/mo. When COBRA runs out, IF I'm able to find insurance - which isn't likely since aside from COPD I'm at the age where I have several other health concerns that insurance companies run from - it will be over $1200/mo. Since I'm just barely managing the $700/mo, I'm going to be screwed. I want your deal. :&)
ok I was wrong.. too high, but I was thinking NYC prices ;-0.
ReplyDeleteMy hospital bill was something like 158,000 and my insurance paid 13,500 and I paid zero.
I'm sure the hospital will negotiate with you on that bill, especially if you're in a position to pay-in-full. I got 10% off a hospital bill that way, which isn't a whole lot, but it's better than nothing. Another thing you could do is request a fully itemized bill and nit pick the hell out of it. I found a $300 charge for something I didn't even get on a bill that way.
ReplyDelete$1200 ambulance bill? You must be in a larger city... one covered by a company like AMR. Our fire department charges way way WAY less than that, and our ambulances are what's called "MICU" (Mobile Intensive Care Unit) with pre-hospital protocols that are very aggressive.
ReplyDeleteAnd if you call and say "Look, I'm broke, but I can pay half" it's all good. Or $25/mo.
I think that you should talk to the hospital billing folks and see if they're willing to negotiate. In most cases, they will.
That pharmacy portion was probably for 2 tylenol, seriously.
ReplyDeleteMost insurance companies have negotiated rates with hospitals and doctors, so, actually, what you're subsidizing are all the people who show up without health care, get treated, and disappear without paying.
ReplyDeleteOMG Ron. I've been so remiss in reading my blogroll that I had no idea this had happened. Grateful that you're okay.
ReplyDeleteWrong anon, I'm paying for those negotiated rates. The people who show up and don't pay are a very small percentage and at this suburban hospital probably almost non existent. I am going to offer the hospital an immediate payment of 60% - about what the insurance companies would pay. We will see what they say.
ReplyDeleteMost hospital companies go into to towns and buy up competing hospitals and shut them down so they can raise the room price.
ReplyDeleteCongrats, you've been linked on reddit.
ReplyDeleteI'm posting to point out that you will likely, additionally, be billed a "physician's fee" from the doctors that saw you. That bill is strictly from the hospital. At least, that's usually the way it is for emergency department visits.
Aren't you actually subsidizing the for-profit hospital?
ReplyDeleteBelieve me, our medical crisis has made its way even down to Veterinary medicine.
ReplyDeleteMy dog got sick and I was looking at an $835 doctors bill.
I have a feeling the insurance industry already has dog insurance waiting in the wings...
I deal with this sort of stuff everyday as im a medical biller and there are a few things to know about the whole expense thing. (note. im not saying any of this is right, I think it needs reform as much as the next person)
ReplyDeleteFirst is the ambulance (didnt read that post just saw it referenced). Unless you want to pay a huge amount or its seriously life threatening, don't ever take a ride in an ambulance. They are all privately owned and they know they can charge you that much and get away with it. If it is possible (sometimes its just not due to other emergencies) take the Fire Rescue truck. Riding in it is covered by the city or county taxes you pay.
As for the medical bill this is why its so much (and thanks to private insurance its never talked about). Private ins pays based on "percentage of medicare", which rate has been negotiated with the healthcare facility. This means if Mcare pay $100 for a procedure a private ins will pay say 80% (which is above average).
The problem with this lays in the fact that Mcare does pay what the actual cost is either. If (once factoring in material costs, labor, malpractice, etc.) a procedure cost(with no profit) $100, Mcare will pay $20. Put the private ins in at only paying $16 for that same procedure and you see health care facilities can loose tons of cash.
In order to make it up, hospitals do what i call the rule of 3. Or if Mcare only pays $100 then those without any ins are charged $300 for that same procedure in order to make up costs.
Thats the jest of why. It sucks I know.
Oh, and Gert is right. in about 2-3 weeks you'll get another fat bill from the ER docs as well. (they aren't employed by the hospital. They rent the space and have their own company)
I was billed $5000 for a 2hr visit to the emergency room for a chestwall pain.
ReplyDelete1 xray, 1 blood test, 1hr of bedtime and one visit by the nice doctor.
Insurance paid $3000, I paid $400 (on my deductible). Hospital wrote off the rest.
shopped.
ReplyDeleteYou being victimized by for-profit corporations. In Canada we have government in charge of our health care, which sucks a little because government is normally wasteful. Still, it's better than putting our care in the hands of private companies who are profit-oriented, unaccountable AND wasteful.
ReplyDeleteYou should move to Canada. Bring a coat.
@Jim Heim - I have good health insurance and they won't even get you in for an appointment, unless it is something pretty serious that has been going on for weeks. At that point, if things get much worse during the wait, they've cut urgent care, so you are stuck going to the emergency room anyway. And the doctors only patch the problem, they don't fix it, which is why I think your wife is seeing these drastic cases. If doctors actually spent the time and insurance companies actually approved payments for health care to fix people's medical problems, you wouldn't be seeing as many people who ARE insured going to the ER, the only place where, despite hours of waiting, you can get real help. Additionally, what do and she expect people without insurance to do? Yeah, you can get COBRA, if you are unemployed, but it is VERY expensive. Choose between eating and having a place to live or paying insurance and possibly not getting sick and not having to use it, and you are taking a gamble. The system doesn't work. Plain and simple.
ReplyDeleteThere is zero excuse for not buying your OWN healthcare. ZERO.
ReplyDeleteStop looking for a handout from the rest of us who are responsible.
heheheh..
ReplyDeletehey anon.. were did he ask you to pay?
voices in the head again... hmmm?