Farewell. The Flying Pig Has Left The Building.

Steve Hynd, August 16, 2012

After four years on the Typepad site, eight years total blogging, Newshoggers is closing it's doors today. We've been coasting the last year or so, with many of us moving on to bigger projects (Hey, Eric!) or simply running out of blogging enthusiasm, and it's time to give the old flying pig a rest.

We've done okay over those eight years, although never being quite PC enough to gain wider acceptance from the partisan "party right or wrong" crowds. We like to think we moved political conversations a little, on the ever-present wish to rush to war with Iran, on the need for a real Left that isn't licking corporatist Dem boots every cycle, on America's foreign misadventures in Afghanistan and Iraq. We like to think we made a small difference while writing under that flying pig banner. We did pretty good for a bunch with no ties to big-party apparatuses or think tanks.

Those eight years of blogging will still exist. Because we're ending this typepad account, we've been archiving the typepad blog here. And the original blogger archive is still here. There will still be new content from the old 'hoggers crew too. Ron writes for The Moderate Voice, I post at The Agonist and Eric Martin's lucid foreign policy thoughts can be read at Democracy Arsenal.

I'd like to thank all our regular commenters, readers and the other bloggers who regularly linked to our posts over the years to agree or disagree. You all made writing for 'hoggers an amazingly fun and stimulating experience.

Thank you very much.

Note: This is an archive copy of Newshoggers. Most of the pictures are gone but the words are all here. There may be some occasional new content, John may do some posts and Ron will cross post some of his contributions to The Moderate Voice so check back.


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Thursday, April 29, 2010

Drone Pilots Are War Criminals: Law Profs

By Steve Hynd


I've thought for some time now that there was a good case to be made that drone attacks on the sovereign territory of nations which the U.S. hadn't declared war against were probably war crimes by virtue of the Nuremberg decision about aggressive warfare - just like Iraq. I also believe there's a good case that drone strikes which cause collateral civilian casualties, be they ever so few, are thus doubly war crimes. But law professors giving testimony to a Congressional panel on Wednesday presented yet another case that drone attacks are war crimes - because they're not conducted by lawful combatants.



Loyola Law School professor David Glazier, a former Navy surface warfare officer, said the pilots operating the drones from afar could � in theory � be hauled into court in the countries where the attacks occur. That�s because the CIA�s drone pilots aren�t combatants in a legal sense. �It is my opinion, as well as that of most other law-of-war scholars I know, that those who participate in hostilities without the combatant�s privilege do not violate the law of war by doing so, they simply gain no immunity from domestic laws,� he said.


�Under this view CIA drone pilots are liable to prosecution under the law of any jurisdiction where attacks occur for any injuries, deaths or property damage they cause,� Glazier continued. �But under the legal theories adopted by our government in prosecuting Guant�mo detainees, these CIA officers as well as any higher-level government officials who have authorized or directed their attacks are committing war crimes.�


 The drones themselves are a lawful tool of war; �In fact, the ability of the drones to engage in a higher level of precision and to discriminate more carefully between military and civilian targets than has existed in the past actually suggests that they�re preferable to many older weapons,� Glazier added. But employing CIA personnel to carry out those armed attacks, he concluded, �clearly fall outside the scope of permissible conduct and ought to be reconsidered, particularly as the United States seeks to prosecute members of its adversaries for generally similar conduct.�


... Mary Ellen O�Connell, professor of law at the University of Notre Dame, was much more blunt in her statement. �Combat drones are battlefield weapons,� she told the panel. �They fire missiles or drop bombs capable of inflicting very serious damage. Drones are not lawful for use outside combat zones. Outside such zones, police are the proper law enforcement agents, and police are generally required to warn before using lethal force.� �Restricting drones to the battlefield is the most important single rule governing their use, O�Connell continued. �Yet, the United States is failing to follow it more often than not.�


O'Connell also agreed with Glazier:



"Only a combatant - a lawful combatant - may carry out the use of killing with combat drones," said Mary Ellen O'Connell, a professor from the University of Notre Dame law school.


"The CIA and civilian contractors have no right to do so. They do not wear uniforms, and they are not in the chain of command. And most importantly they are not trained in the law of armed conflict."


O'Connell also claimed that "we know from empirical data ... that the use of major military force in counterterrorism operations has been counterproductive." The U.S. government, she asserted, should only use force "when we can accomplish more good than harm, and that is not the case with the use of drones in places like Pakistan, Yemen and Somalia."


In Pakistan, Yemen and Somalia, drone strikes are the "only game in town" when it comes to military strikes on suspected militants. That doesn't make them right, or lawful. As we've seen time and again, the Obama administration is so scared of being labelled weak on national security that it has kept going or even escalated Bush administration unlawful programs. But "for reasons of domestic politics" is no more a legal defense than "just following orders".



2 comments:

  1. I agree with this but the killer bushes are criminals as well. Nothing will happen to these people bushes or other and it's high time our side starts to understand there is more going on than meets the eye.

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  2. Thanks for pointing this out, Steve. There's some serious food for thought here. I've always had issue with the way in which drone strikes are carried out, but the thought that they may be illegal per se hadn't occured to me. The unlawful combatant issue is particularly thought-provoking given the emphasis that the Right has placed on the notion that almost anyone captured in Afghanistan is an "unlawful combatant" for substantially the same reasons provided here.

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